Tuesday 24 July 2007

Jeff's fake War story subject to independent Review

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Jeff Mowatt

Now for a real war story
« on: May 08, 2007, 05:03:58 AM »


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Those like myself who've been on the circuit a while will know that there are predators out there and they're not always RW. Sometimes they're disaffected expats as I found to my cost in Kharkov. He's been living there now for around 7 years and quickly latched on when he learned of a plan to leverage development funding. Regrettably, this was after having shown him a printed summary. His mistake was to ask for business visa support which meant supplying passport details, so there's no doubt of his identity. His request was denied as we learned more.

For the last year, My colleague and I have been under constant bombardment. It started with hoaxing forum logins to create the impression of substance abuse. A host of anonymous id's then began defaming us, to the point of him being barred from a major news site forum though they were unable to lock him out of the news commentary. He's still there posting abuse every weekend which the site now deletes every Monday morning as they return to work.

By October last year I became aware that he was now blogging his abuse which included a scanned copy of the document he'd been offered in confidence. I took it up with Google who would do nothing, so I started my own blog in defence. One of the posts contained his passport number which he complained about and got Google to remove, though they would take no action against the blog commenced earlier that defames me, my colleague our organisation and publishes our work without permission.

As a small time politician he publishes a professional blog with code now embedded to redirect Ukrainian viewers to the smear blog. It offers the impression of local activity in a place he's not been living in for the last 7 years.

I've been telephone in England by his "legal advisor" informing me of their intention to sue, for publishing his name online. It turned out to be someone using a former marriage name which she doesn't use professionally. She's a UK
barrister, and her professional name reveals that she's his sister. Her own web traces on genealogy forums state that she's been out of touch with her disfunctional family for 20 years. He now appears to be using her former marriage name to write intimidating letters to web editors. I suspect she's being used too, in the hope of reestablishing lost family contact.

As a barrister she'd be hauled over the coals for approaching the public, so I have to assume that it's his own hand at play. I have copies of this and another communication in his own real name as do a group of about six other people who have pledged support, should he really pursue his threat of legal action.

With Google failing to support me and deal even handedly, we are stuck. What he's doing would render him liable for criminal prosecution in the country where he claims to be residing. As many know, in Ukraine law enforcement is often a matter of purchase.

Should we sue in Ukraine, no doubt it would be a newsworthy item and he'd be exposed whatever the outcome.

As it is, we've made some progress in spite of his efforts but there's no doubt that harm will continue to be done.

Is it worth it?


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I/O

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LOL LOL LOL LOL: LOL

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Gator

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #2 on: May 08, 2007, 06:52:19 AM »

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Jeff,

The connection to women eludes me. This seems more like a personal vendetta.


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Jeff Mowatt

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #3 on: May 08, 2007, 08:12:00 AM »

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Gator, yes that's what it's turned into it seems and why I avoid mentioning any names.

Essentially this is all about women, especially those with children, who have most to gain from poverty reduction programmes. In Tomsk for instance it has been demonstrated that more than 80% of those who took the opportunity to create SMEs under microfinance initiatives were women.

Empowering women makes for the economic equality that does not currently exist between those that we may want to make our partners, the very essence of what brings the White Knight factor into being.

Were you aware for instance, that of all children in institutional care, approximately 90% have families who are unable to provide for them, that those who escape such places preferring to live on the streets are a breeding ground for HIV infection rates 15 times greater than Western Europe?

Now It might appear that doing something like this was against the interests of what's been dubbed the MOB industry, but if nothing is done about it Ukraine won't be a place anyone wants to seek a bride or adopt children from. If they do nothing to address the state of institutional childcare, they'll be excluded from joining Europe on human rights grounds.

So, in one sense it's nothing to do with the immediate and romantic relationships, yet in another it's everything to do with the future of women in Eastern Europe.

Jeff
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William3rd

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #4 on: May 08, 2007, 09:27:32 AM »

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I am sorry- this thread makes no sense. What is being said here?

defamation, substance abuse, Kharkov. . . . . Could you start over from the beginning and give enough FACTS so that the uneducated like myself can get a handle on what this story is all about?

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I/O
Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #5 on: May 08, 2007, 09:34:40 AM »

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Quote from: William3rd on May 08, 2007, 09:27:32 AM
substance abuse

William: I maybe wrong and I hope I am but I suspect my extract from your post might well be the key to the thread.

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Jeff Mowatt

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #6 on: May 08, 2007, 09:52:31 AM »

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I can't really guys, not without naming names and this isn't the place I want to bring a battle

What I'm saying about substance abuse is that first instances of harrassment came in the form of anonyomous messages using a forum login (not here I should add) which closely resembled that of a colleague. The content was such that it indicated someone looking for narcotic supplies.

Having been rumbled by other participants, there were then a variety of aliases making allegations about criminal intent. They were eventually all blocked by moderators. At the same time our reports on human rights issues were deleted to remove the source of provocation. it didn't stop the continued claims however offering links to a defamatory blog

The site owners complained publicly about their site being flooded with abusive comments. The bogus lawyer identity was then used to apply pressure to have that removed. Meanwhile the blog abuse continued with no response from Google to complaints. When he was then identified in my own blog, Google acted to remove his identification.

So. that's where we are now, being run down by something we're powerless to act against.

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William3rd

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #7 on: May 08, 2007, 11:03:55 AM »

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not enough information here to determine what you are talking about.

Not recommended reading. . . . .

I/O- you are probably right in your surmise

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WmGO
Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #8 on: May 08, 2007, 11:38:18 AM »

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Quote from: Jeff Mowatt on May 08, 2007, 08:12:00 AM
If they do nothing to address the state of institutional childcare



A serious issue. And you may be aware but there is a tremendous amount of Western and American effort to help alleviate the problems in this area...........it is much much worse in Russia than in Ukraine...........

Other than that, I don't see how this thread is relevant to RWD.

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Jeff Mowatt

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #9 on: May 08, 2007, 11:47:14 AM »

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OK, let me try to make it clearer.

Though this wasn't the beginning, all hell broke loose when we released this story below. We'd gained the trust of the leading citizens activist network in Ukraine who gave us editorial permissions on their English language portal:

http://eng.maidanua.org/node/581

As you probably know there's a political battle going on in Ukraine right now, with oligarchic interests wanting to retain control and the status quo at all costs. Many people don't want a story like this to be told, though Maiden still backs us up as you can see from its continued existence there. There are some good people who don't want it know fearing for their own humanitarian efforts and being excluded, others with personal interests in adoption and a darker contingent who find it politically threatening.

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ScottinCrimea

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #10 on: May 09, 2007, 06:44:20 PM »

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Thre is a bit of a hidden agenda going on here, guys. I did some research and learned some interesting things about Jeff and his associate, whose initials are TH.

You may want to check out a couple of sites, including a thread in For-UA.com and the following link:
http://www.publiuspundit.com/wp/index.php/?p=444

Bear in mind that his business associate runs the Maidan website when you read his link.

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Kuna

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #11 on: May 09, 2007, 08:38:20 PM »

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Good grief!

Nice detective work Scott.... now we can all get back to the real intent of participating in RWD.

Kuna

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Jeff Mowatt

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #12 on: May 10, 2007, 04:46:29 AM »

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Not really Kuna, no detective work at all in fact in uncovering an instance of a smear campaign. Does this explain why the leading citizens rights group in Ukraine have not removed the report from their website? Yes, we have editorial permission to post there, but we cannot claim to be in personal control of the Orange Revolution.

What you'll find all over the internet, in fact are my contributions in my own name and those of an anonymous detractor who is terrified of being identified. So terrified in fact that using the name of a bogus lawyer he's managed to persuade Google to remove his name from my defense against his actions while continuing to publish his smears.

OK, read the smear blog, with its manifest allegations, then perhaps the link below will be understandable:

http://stopcyberbullying....ng.com/profile/JeffMowatt

Now, try some of my detective work. You may not like it because it points to Australia. Open the link below and examine the javascript code in the page source. Can you then explain why someone with ambitions of political office would want to conduct an anonymous campaign such as this?

http://tinyurl.com/2utuq7

Now you can say "Good Grief!" and if you want to follow what this disturbed mind has been doing in his last 7 years in Ukraine while masquerading as an Australian resident. If you're that interested you can even follow his progress as the assault continues and his own critics tear him to shreds on his news commentary and the forum where all his known aliases have been barred.

http://en.for-ua.com/

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Kuna

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #13 on: May 10, 2007, 10:50:15 AM »

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Errrr... Not really Jeff. I don't see what any of this has to do with Russian Women or discussion about the same.

I've read some of the "gumf" from both sides and think there's some people with WAYYYYy too much time on their hands.

Personally... I like the fact that RWD is focused on discussion about Russian women and I'm glad we don't get involved in petty cyber disputes.

All the best...

Kuna

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ScottinCrimea

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #14 on: May 10, 2007, 11:05:33 AM »

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Jeff,
I have my own opinions about what is happening with you and your colleagues and I don't really think you would be happy to hear them. My point is that this is a board, as Kuna wrote, whose purpose is the discussion of the pursuit, understanding and love of Russian women. If you want to post about personal issues and your experience, comments and questions related to this, you are welcome here, but please don't attempt

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Admin

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #15 on: May 10, 2007, 11:07:26 AM »

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Quote from: Jeff Mowatt on May 10, 2007, 04:46:29 AM
Not really Kuna, no detective work at all in fact in uncovering an instance of a smear campaign. Does this explain why the leading citizens rights group in Ukraine have not removed the report from their website? Yes, we have editorial permission to post there, but we cannot claim to be in personal control of the Orange Revolution.

What you'll find all over the internet, in fact are my contributions in my own name and those of an anonymous detractor who is terrified of being identified. So terrified in fact that using the name of a bogus lawyer he's managed to persuade Google to remove his name from my defense against his actions while continuing to publish his smears.

OK, read the smear blog, with its manifest allegations, then perhaps the link below will be understandable:

http://stopcyberbullying....ng.com/profile/JeffMowatt

Now, try some of my detective work. You may not like it because it points to Australia. Open the link below and examine the javascript code in the page source. Can you then explain why someone with ambitions of political office would want to conduct an anonymous campaign such as this?

http://tinyurl.com/2utuq7

Now you can say "Good Grief!" and if you want to follow what this disturbed mind has been doing in his last 7 years in Ukraine while masquerading as an Australian resident. If you're that interested you can even follow his progress as the assault continues and his own critics tear him to shreds on his news commentary and the forum where all his known aliases have been barred.

http://en.for-ua.com/




Jeff,

Admittedly, I have not (and do not plan to) take the time to fully-appreciate the 'issue' you are raising.

Please provide a condensed version - and, in particular, how it ties into the theme and mission of RWD.

Thanks,

- Dan

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Jeff Mowatt
Member


Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #16 on: May 10, 2007, 11:31:39 AM »

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Dan, Elsewhere in this forum I find threads which discuss the abuse of children and the economic circumstances which prevail in the former Soviet Union. Like many others here, I have participated in the search for a partner in this region and am as aware as most that these economic conditions are the primary motivation for Russian women to seek out a life overseas. Perhaps this one is misplaced in this category, but I sought to describe the experience which led me from being there to take part in the "MOB" selection process, gain a deeper understanding of the social environment and commit myself to efforts that would bring about change and level the playing field.

If that's inappropriate, then by all means consider it off topic and remove the discussion.

Believe me Kuna, this is entirely about Russian, specifically Ukrainian women. It may be inappropriate in this section or not suit your interest, but it's about a human rights effort to improve conditions for Russian/Ukrainian women and children.

You've proclaimed "Great detective work" so you've been interested enough to comment but when presented with something which contradicts this, you don't want to know.

This isn't leisure for me, it's a full time effort in which all resources are directed, my business revenue and my time.

How I decide to spend that time is entirely my own concern and if it requires fending off allegations from "anonymous" detractors, then so be it. You aren't obliged to participate.

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Admin
Administrator

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #17 on: May 10, 2007, 11:42:22 AM »

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Quote from: Jeff Mowatt on May 10, 2007, 11:31:39 AM
Dan, Elsewhere in this forum I find threads which discuss the abuse of children and the economic circumstances which prevail in the former Soviet Union. Like many others here, I have participated in the search for a partner in this region and am as aware as most that these economic conditions are the primary motivation for Russian women to seek out a life overseas. Perhaps this one is misplaced in this category, but I sought to describe the experience which led me from being there to take part in the "MOB" selection process, gain a deeper understanding of the social environment and commit myself to efforts that would bring about change and level the playing field.

If that's inappropriate, then by all means consider it off topic and remove the discussion.

Believe me Kuna, this is entirely about Russian, specifically Ukrainian women. It may be inappropriate in this section or not suit your interest, but it's about a human rights effort to improve conditions for Russian/Ukrainian women and children.

You've proclaimed "Great detective work" so you've been interested enough to comment but when presented with something which contradicts this, you don't want to know.

This isn't leisure for me, it's a full time effort in which all resources are directed, my business revenue and my time.

How I decide to spend that time is entirely my own concern and if it requires fending off allegations from "anonymous" detractors, then so be it. You aren't obliged to participate.



Jeff,

I think the concern is that RWD has just come through the experience of organized groups with agendas different from our own - worked to distract/derail the site. They sought to pursue their agendas and wanted to leverage the popularity built at RWD for their platform.

While there is *some* room for that - the concern is that we end up with a diminution of the mission of RWD to cater to the agendas of others - and that is not healthy for RWD in the long-term.

I hope you see my point.

RWD has the mission to be (and it is) the premier site for men to gather and share information about the pursuit of a life-partner from the FSU countries.

To the extent your agenda falls within that space, or is complementary, it is welcomed. If it is too far afield, then you will find the responsible members of RWD (like Kuna and Scott and others) will rein in the discussions. This is normal for RWD.

- Dan

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Jeff Mowatt
Member


Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #18 on: May 10, 2007, 12:05:58 PM »

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Dan, I understand and accept your point. I'm a seasoned participant in RW discussion groups going back to the old RWL group at St Johns and a moderator of many groups myself. I deal with precisely the same problems and sought only to describe experiences in a generalised form. In doing so here, I've been asked to be specific and pointed to the source of the most difficult problem I've encounted to-date.

I still have an active interest in RW discussions which extends to the work I've described already, a support group for the victims of Beslan a campaign for recognition of the Holodomor, a campaign to raise awareness of HIV prevention in Ukraine and support for the Nastenka fund for children with cancer in Russia.

These are my declared interests, part of me and my experience arising from relationships with Russian women. I will desist from bringing them into discussion as advised.

Jeff

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WmGO

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #19 on: May 10, 2007, 12:56:30 PM »

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Quote from: ScottinCrimea on May 10, 2007, 11:05:33 AM
Jeff,
I have my own opinions about what is happening with you and your colleagues and I don't really think you would be happy to hear them. My point is that this is a board, as Kuna wrote, whose purpose is the discussion of the pursuit, understanding and love of Russian women. If you want to post about personal issues and your experience, comments and questions related to this, you are welcome here, but please don't attempt to bring a diffeent agenda onto this board. There are plenty of other places for that.


Agree totally...........but I want to add this: I have been waiting a couple of days to let all this sink in. Particularly after reading the maidan web link that this VERY ODD Jeff fellow posted about Ukrainian orphanages being some kind of naziisk death camps.

I have been inside over two dozen orphanages in Ukraine delivering humanitarian and other aid. I have never seen anything remotely akin to what Mowatt's maidan aritcle suggests. Now I am sure that I have not been to the worst of the worst orphanages, but what I *have* seen is that the vast majority of Ukrainians working in these places are very serious and conscientious to do their best with limited resources. They keep the buildings immaculately clean and organized. They do their best to care for these kids. That is what I have seen with my own two eyes. I have friends that have been inside over one hundred Ukrainian orphanges delivering aid and that is also what their collective experiences have been, and yes we never provide out right cash aid because yes it is known that *some* administrators might put it in their pocket........but.....

In the cases of severe retardation or deformity, yes it is a sad picture, but with limited resources it is never going to be an Alice in Wonderland scene........but to suggest that these orphanage workers are engaging in some type of Joseph Mengela death camp activity on a nation wide scale is outrageous and beyond the Pale.

Now, I have seen in some documetaries someseverly retarded kids in a few Russian orphanages kept in cages.....one of the U.S. news shows like 60 Minutes or 20/20 had a show about that a few years ago....so there seem to be a few pockets of really bad orphanaaes in Russia, but I have never seen nor heard of any such places in Ukraine, nor does the maidan web link article OR THE PHOTOS prove or reflect any such activity..............FWIW.

Now I agree with Scott and Kuna that this Mowatt fellow needs to take his political or whatever it is agenda somewhere else.............

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Jeff Mowatt

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #20 on: July 03, 2007, 03:13:57 AM »

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OK, coming back here having sorted out one or two issues because I thought we'd agreed that this wasn't appropriate to the forum.

I thank Gator and Dan for their civil contributions to the discussion. Some may not find what I relate either credible or palatable, but all the same I haven't misrepresented myself.

I have my own impressions about a lawyer making snide remarks here about me indulging in some form of substance abuse or indeed anyone representing themselves in business whose first instinct is to offer abuse to support their viewpoint.

This parting shot above, delivered in a patronising third person style obliges me to remind you, WmGo, that you're on a discussion forum, not a pulpit from which you may opine.

Was it not you, elsewhere, who said "I think this Mowatt guy is a lazy bum"? I may be wrong, but the style seems familiar.

It's the style of the moral coward. The creep that relishes the confrontation that he'd never have the courage to take a stand on personally, but will sneak in for a kick when he senses defeat. The "Ugly American" at his most unattractive.

I can see I won't be able to enlighten you. You'll insist that I wrote that article and that Maidan is my own site which doesn't say a lot for your power of comprehension What I will be able to do, homie, is teach you some manners.

I'll do it here, no charge and look forward to meeting you one day to deliver some real home truths.

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DKMM

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #21 on: July 03, 2007, 03:30:39 AM »

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I'm starting to see where the subtance abuse allegations came from.

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Jeff Mowatt

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #22 on: July 03, 2007, 04:04:00 AM »

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Please say what you mean DKMM. Bring it on, rather than sniping as yet another anonymous critic.

The name is Jeff Mowatt, as ever, try addressing me, make your introduction....

A case of "Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain" perhaps?

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catzenmouse

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #23 on: July 03, 2007, 08:59:40 AM »

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So please tell us "The name is Jeff Mowatt" what is your purpose in coming back here?

Yes, yes! Please tell us Jeff Mowatt, what could it possibly be?

More investors needed?

More misinformation to impart?

More snippy posts to be made?

What do you have to offer here now that you have things worked out?

Inquiring minds want to know...

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I/O

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #24 on: July 03, 2007, 09:08:39 AM »

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Quote from: Jeff Mowatt on July 03, 2007, 03:13:57 AM
OK, coming back here having sorted out one or two issues because I thought we'd agreed that this wasn't appropriate to the forum.

Rather paradoxical statement.

I/O

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ScottinCrimea

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #25 on: July 03, 2007, 11:41:19 AM »

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Jeff, now that you have things sorted out, the first thing you need to do to have any credibiltiy at all on this subject is to answer the many questons that were posed to you before. If you want to be a member of this forum and discuss Russian Women and the various issues that inevitably seem to branch off from that subject, you are welcome. But be prepared to back up any stand you take and be prepared for some hard questions if things don't seem on the level. As you have maybe realized, there are some very sharp guye here with a very wide variety of knowledge and experience and you can't get away with much if that is your purpose.

So welcome back, bring up a topic that you have questions or advice about and jump in with sound opinion and ideas about other topics.

Logged

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Jack

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #26 on: July 03, 2007, 03:38:27 PM »

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hey Jeff, I don't think we have met, maybe we have. If you PM me with your contact information I'll look you up in 9 weeks when I'm in Kharkov.

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ecr844

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #27 on: July 03, 2007, 03:50:25 PM »

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Quote from: Jeff Mowatt on July 03, 2007, 04:04:00 AM
The name is Jeff Mowatt, as ever, try addressing me, make your introduction....

A case of "Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain" perhaps?


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« Last Edit: July 03, 2007, 04:20:51 PM by ecr844 » Logged

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Jeff Mowatt

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #28 on: July 04, 2007, 03:21:34 AM »

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Hi Jack,

I won't be in Kharkiv in the foreseeable future, certainly not before September but I believe you know and have met Terry Hallman there before.

Scott, I can't tell you much more than I have already. The purpose of the paper now delivered to Kyiv, is to lay out a broad strategy for development based on proven approaches in childcare reform, microfinance and community broadband deployment. We have never solicited donations, all efforts have been from our own funds.

There are several reasons we can't say more. The first is obviously commercial, as you will know people kill for business in Ukraine. We are reliably informed for instance, that the national telephone carrier employs a team of around 60 people to eavesdrop on business conversations.

The second is fear. The "Death Camps" story came from an American NGO who've agreed that we can publish it sanitised to remove all references to identities and locations, who made an introduction to an Ukrainian NGO with many similar cases documented. Neither will put their own projects at risk by identifying themselves. In the last few weeks another operation based in Australia came forward approaching us with a similar scenario. Again when we asked them to put their names to what they'd reported they backed down.

This wasn't any part of the strategy paper. It's been know to us only for the last year after 5 years involvement in country which began with Terry speaking out in a Kyiv Post article about starving children on the streets of Ukraine. All he could do was to make it plain that something would need to be done about it, in the same way that the EU expected Romania to comply in their childcare institutions.

Finally, there are those whose interests are best served by promoting civic disruption. You live in Crimea and should be aware of developing tensions there between Tatar and ethnic Russians, for instance. This "war story" is about one peculiar individual who pumps out pro-Russian propaganda on a variety of forums for reasons which aren't entirely clear. We know has an agenda for proportional representation and continues an assault on the council of his home town in Australia who failed to elect him as a representative. He's been barred from the For-UA website under all his aliases where the editor pleaded for him to stop flooding the site with his smears, at last and now under the name of ukrtoday, plagues the Pravda forum with his continued accusations against Ukraine's presidency.

http://forum.pravda.com.ua/read.php?9,2449084

This is plainly a man who harbours many grudges and aside from the City of Melbourne and Ukraine's president, he's made Terry and I another of his targets. He's outplayed his welcome in the expat community of Kharkiv where many regard him as psychotic. We also know from locals who have connections with security services that at least 4 groups are keeping tabs on him, including the SBU.

Now if the testimony of this individual is what you base any assessment on, I can only say that it really doesn't trouble me what anyone here thinks of my credibility. Few here have as much exposure to Ukraine and even then purely on the dimension of the so-called "MOB business". I can read plenty of accusations and insulting remarks but no real in depth knowledge of this country.

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Kuna

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #29 on: July 04, 2007, 03:34:54 AM »

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All sound like fun to me...

Jeff... hey Jeff... can I have some of that stuff you're on?

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ScottinCrimea

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #30 on: July 04, 2007, 11:49:41 AM »

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Jeff, I didn't take your detractor at his word. I checked things out and everything he claimed did check out while nothing you claim does. No matter his source or his motivation, he's right on the money. You didn't provide a single reference for any of your claims, even when asked specifically.

Your claim that you have never solicited donations is an outright lie. In your own documents you mention seeking funding by various government programs or charitable sources. You and Terry have no funds, and certainly not enough to fund the project you propose, which I think you stated would require somewhere in the neighborhood of 1.1 billion. You're just a couple of scam artists trying to sucker anyone in that you can by appealing to their soft side using the specter of child death camps or poor starving Tatars.

As far as real indepth knowledge of Ukraine, it doesn't take much to see through your lies, and those of us who actually live there are perfectly willing to go one on one with you in a debate on the "real" Ukraine.

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Jeff Mowatt

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #31 on: July 04, 2007, 12:04:42 PM »

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That Scott is misrepresentation. I believe there's such a suggestion in the whitepaper from 1996 but you'll find no evidence of us seeking donations in Ukraine to undertake this project. In the end it is between two governments

You have quoted a detractor in saying that Terry Hallman claimed to be a personal friend of Bill Clinton. Terry never claimed that, he worked on his re-election campaign and here below is the response I got from his Presidential Library.

Other than that, the Ukraine paper was delivered to the US Embassy in Kyiv

I am trying to comply with Dan's request to discontinue these threads but if you simply return to to call me a liar, then I believe I have a right to respond.

I have the impression that you simply press on because you won't accept your misjudgement.

Dear Mr. Mowatt:

Thank you for contacting the Clinton Presidential Library. The
document you seek is part of the Clinton campaign records. These papers have
not been deeded to anyone. Hence, they remain under the control of
President Clinton and currently are not available for research.

If we can be of any further assistance, please do not hesitate to
contact us.

Sincerely,


Jimmie Purvis
Archivist
Clinton Presidential Library
1200 President Clinton Avenue
Little Rock, Arkansas 72201
(501) 244-2868


>>> "Jeff Mowatt" 06/29/05 09:09AM >>>

Hello,
I'm trying to locate a white-paper for the steering committee to
reelect the President in 1996. The paper, written by Terry E Hallman promoted
the concepts of social capitalism, social economics, and social
enterprise.
Would your library have retained a copy of this document?

Kind regards,

Jeff Mowatt
London UK



Quote from: ScottinCrimea on July 04, 2007, 11:49:41 AM
Jeff, I didn't take your detractor at his word. I checked things out and everything he claimed did check out while nothing you claim does. No matter his source or his motivation, he's right on the money. You didn't provide a single reference for any of your claims, even when asked specifically.

Your claim that you have never solicited donations is an outright lie. In your own documents you mention seeking funding by various government programs or charitable sources. You and Terry have no funds, and certainly not enough to fund the project you propose, which I think you stated would require somewhere in the neighborhood of 1.1 billion. You're just a couple of scam artists trying to sucker anyone in that you can by appealing to their soft side using the specter of child death camps or poor starving Tatars.

As far as real indepth knowledge of Ukraine, it doesn't take much to see through your lies, and those of us who actually live there are perfectly willing to go one on one with you in a debate on the "real" Ukraine.

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William3rd

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #32 on: July 04, 2007, 12:24:14 PM »

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The IGNORE button is definitely an option to controll thread-based diarrhea of the keyboards.

Now if there was just a way to place entire threads on ignore. . . .

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BC

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #33 on: July 04, 2007, 12:29:53 PM »

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Quote from: William3rd on July 04, 2007, 12:24:14 PM
Now if there was just a way to place entire threads on ignore. . . .


Yeah.. haven't found that button either..

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ecr844

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #34 on: July 04, 2007, 12:35:10 PM »

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Sadly even this zealot can't recognize his inherent delusion...

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William3rd

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #35 on: July 04, 2007, 12:58:19 PM »

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The only unfortunate thing is that some of the readership either takes him seriously or plays into him too realistically.

If no one responds, he will go away. . . . . I hope

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Jeff Mowatt

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #36 on: July 04, 2007, 03:21:57 PM »

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Why chip in with your 2c then Billy Boy?

Won't you get arrested for that picture btw?

You are not allowed to view images.
Please register or login Achieve strike 3 and you are history - without notice.

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Mod2
Super Moderator

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #37 on: July 04, 2007, 03:28:13 PM »

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Quote from: Jeff Mowatt on July 04, 2007, 03:21:57 PM
Why chip in with your 2c then Billy Boy?

Won't you get arrested for that picture btw?


Crude and Rude.

Strike 2

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ScottinCrimea

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #38 on: July 04, 2007, 06:35:29 PM »

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Let's see: Last I checked it's now 2007. 2007 - 1996 = 11 years. It sounds like a hot issue for the US government that has people all in a dither to save the world with its groundbreaking new concepts of socio-economic reform.

Why doesn't your old friend have a copy of his own essay? Why do you need a copy from the Clinton Library? And how do you know what is in it if you don't have a copy?

Frist rule of common sense: "When you find yourself in a hole, the first thing to do is stop digging."

You're shoveling a lot more than dirt here.

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Jeff Mowatt

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #39 on: July 05, 2007, 05:21:38 AM »

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Scott, it's you I believe that digging desperately. When you extract script from a smear blog and present it as fact for instance and then when corrected, simply ignore it and switch to a new tack.

Yes, I verified as much as I could by contacting the Clinton library and yes, he had lost his only remaining copy when digital storage was possible but not so commonplace.

Continuing to shout fraud and lies while you simply skip around what you are offered to find new faults, doesn't make you right, but it does indicate your intellectual dishonesty and moral cowardice pretty clearly.

Just like this detractor in fact, who will continue his anonymous smear campaign rather than report the crime which he claims is taking place. .

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Kuna

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #40 on: July 05, 2007, 08:28:45 AM »

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Quote from: Jeff Mowatt on July 05, 2007, 05:21:38 AM
but it does indicate your intellectual dishonesty and moral cowardice pretty clearly.



Jeff,

Get real... you have made claims and assertions that simply can't be supported by fact. You can dance around it as much as you want but the reality is you're living a fantasy.

You must be mighty bored to spend your life dreaming like you do (I'm talking about your wireless telco network here) and sadly you'll leave this world feeling like a failure.

Get a grip.. be honest with yourself... reach inside and be courageous enough to accept that you're living a fantasy.

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I/O

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #41 on: July 05, 2007, 08:46:53 AM »

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Mowhawk: Two very simple questions to give you another chance to establish some credability.

1) Exactly what do you hope to achieve on this board?

2) What laws has my country enacted to protect Russian women from the likes of me? (One of your many abstract comments)

I/O

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ScottinCrimea

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #42 on: July 05, 2007, 07:15:38 PM »

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Okay, Jeff, I asked you multiple times to verify your claims and all you can come up with is a letter to the Clinton Library and call that proof of everything? Remember I asked you, given all the lofty claims of influence and success, to provide me with a single reference that I could contact and you were unable to do that. Those organizations and individuals that I was able to contact basically refuted everything that you claimed. So the ball's in your court now. Either provide the independent references, or shut up.

This detractor that you speak of at least backs up his claims. You only try to attack him because you can't respond credibly. I'm afraid he has earned a lot more credibility than you.

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William3rd

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #43 on: July 05, 2007, 07:20:21 PM »

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Was he referring to my picture? With a 36 year old woman? Tough thing about ignore- you have to look at quotes to see what is said when you are pointedly not reading the content any more.

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ecr844

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #44 on: July 05, 2007, 07:30:48 PM »

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Quote from: William3rd on July 05, 2007, 07:20:21 PM
Was he referring to my picture? With a 36 year old woman? Tough thing about ignore- you have to look at quotes to see what is said when you are pointedly not reading the content any more.


"William,"

You only missed the fact he made a defamatory remark stating to the effect that "Someone should call the FBI on you;" implying you were 'violating' the lady in the picture and that perhaps she 'may not be of age'.



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catzenmouse

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #45 on: July 05, 2007, 07:49:45 PM »

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I don't think that anyone here ever expects Maugwa to tell the truth and come clean.

A troll does not have the "moral bravery" to go there.

They are quite good at deflecting and projecting their own inadequacies onto others. It probably works pretty well in a forum full of some lower life form such as they belong to. Perhaps the Orc forum would be good. They aren't too bright. Ah well... such is the life of a professional troll....

Ken

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William3rd
Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #46 on: July 05, 2007, 08:50:31 PM »

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Ohhhh- is that all he said? That could be almost a compliment .

I gave up on reading his material. Obi-wan Kenobi made a lot more sense than this guy.

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catzenmouse

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #47 on: July 05, 2007, 09:23:57 PM »

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Quote from: William3rd on July 05, 2007, 08:50:31 PM
Obi-wan Kenobi made a lot more sense than this guy.

Very apropos William! His motto much be: "May the Farce be with you"

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Kharkovite

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #48 on: July 23, 2007, 07:25:02 PM »

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I wish to apologize in advance for re-invigorating Mr. Mowatt's posts but it has just been brought to my attention that Mr. Mowatt once again is on his tirade of abuse, false and misleading information.

I noticed that Mr. Mowatt is now seeking to claim some credit and involvement in a recent announcement by the government. who in the run up to an election have announced determination to spend money on various welfare projects.

I have heard similar claims made by Jeff Mowatt and his associate before.

What I fail to see yet again is any evidence that supports the nation that Mr. Mowatt and his associate Terry Hallman have had anything significant to do with the recent announcement. like most of their other claims supporting evidence is lacking as to their involvement and claims of success.

Not once could we find any independent supporting evidence to back up Mr. Mowatt's claims of success. not once. myself and others are still waiting 18 months later nothing.

I find it strange that Mr. Mowatt has, yet again chosen to spruke bleeding heart war story his war story on this site.

Mr. Mowatt on a recent posting on a Ukrainian political debate forum made the following reference (referring to members of this site)


Quote
They are mostly American mail order bride seekers, the dumber kind who have very little knowledge of the territory, little political interest or social awareness.


I think the comment above speaks for itself, and if I may, I would like to distance myself from this comment as in reading some of the comments on this board in particular I have come to the conclusion that those who contribute to the discussions on this forum are very much well informed.

Once again I apologize for feeling the need to respond to Mr. Mowatt recent statements.

This whole vendetta thing with Mr. Mowatt followed on from a meeting with his associate in Kharkov. It was only when we undertook some further research into the claims being made that we began to smell a rat. When we asked question about the nature of Mr. Mowatt's business which he was prompting instead of answers we only got abuse, insults and more abuse. When further challenged Mr. Mowatt saw fit to publish personal details such as passport banking details as some sort of intimidation.

18 months on the only person drawing attention to Mr. Mowatt's "war injuries stories" is himself.

Mr. Mowatt clearly feels he has something to prove.

If he has something to prove then answer the basic questions that myself and others have asked. Provide substantial evidence to back up his claims of success and stop spuking his campaign of harassment of myself, my family and associates.

Mr. Mowatt continues to stalk me, my family and my business associates and in the process incite others to participate in his ongoing vendetta.

If I can suggest please close this comment also...


Other news article
http://www.russianwomendi...m/index.php?topic=4687.60

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Admin

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #49 on: July 23, 2007, 09:34:04 PM »

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Quote from: Kharkovite on July 23, 2007, 07:25:02 PM
I wish to apologise in advance for re-invigorating Mr. Mowatt's posts but it has just been brought to my attention that Mr. Mowatt once again is on his tirade of abuse, false and misleading information.

I noticed that Mr. Mowatt is now seeking to claim some credit and involvement in a recent announcement by the government. who in the run up to an election have announced determination to spend money on various welfare projects.

I have heard similar claims made by Jeff Mowatt and his associate before.

What I fail to see yet again is any evidence that supports the nation that Mr. Mowatt and his associate Terry Hallman have had anything significant to do with the recent announcement. like most of their other claims supporting evidence is lacking as to their involvement and claims of success.

Not once could we find any independent supporting evidence to back up Mr. Mowatt's claims of sucess. not once. myself and others are still waiting 18 months later nothing.

I find it strange that Mr. Mowat has, yet again chosen to spruke bleeding heart bwar story his war story on this site.

Mr. Mowatt on a recent posting on a Ukrainian political debate forum made the following reference (referring to members of this site)

I think the comment above speaks for itself, and if I may, I would like to distance myself from this comment as in reading some of the comments on this board in particular I have come to the conclusion that those who contribute to the discussions on this forum are very much well informed.

Once again I apologize for feeling the need to respond to Mr. Mowatt recent statements.

This whole vendetta thing with Mr. Mowatt followed on from a meeting with his associate in Kharkov. It was only when we undertook some further research into the claims being made that we began to smell a rat..When we asked question about the nature of Mr. Mowatt's business which he was prompting instad of answers we only got abuse, insults and more abuse. When further challenged Mr. Mowatt saw fit to publish personal details such as passport banking details as some sort of imtimidation.

18 months on the only person drawing attention to Mr. Mowatt's "war injuries stories" is himself.

Mr. Mowatt clearly feels he has something to prove.

If he has something to prove then answer the basic questions that myself and others have asked. Provide substancial evidence to back up his claims of success and stop spuking his campiagn of harrassment of myslef, my family and associates.

Mr. Mowatt continues to stalk me, my family and my business associates and in the process incite others to particpate in his ongoing vendetta.

If I can suggest please close this comment also...


Other news article
http://www.russianwomendi...m/index.php?topic=4687.60



Sometimes people come onto RWD and manage to, relatively quickly, self-implode. Those are usually people who come here with an 'agenda' and they are quickly found out.

At this point, the Mowatt situation has enjoyed far too much 'air-time' at RWD. It is clearly a distraction and diversion from the theme of RWD - as are the follow-ups, no matter how compelled or well-intended the comments.

Suggest - rather than apologize for "re-invigorating" the posts - you let it lie. Totally.

- Dan

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Kharkovite

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #50 on: July 23, 2007, 10:31:22 PM »

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Dan I understand but as I said I did not raise this issue on this forum, I am merely responding to his ongoing vendetta. Mr. Mowatt has and continues to make unsubstantiated, false claims. He has on more them one occasion published on this site and others personal information. Information that has placed myself,. my family and my associates at some risk

His comment about American Bride hunters is another example of his personal issues.

Why he raised this issue on this site under this contact I fail to comprehend. As long as he continues to make such unsubstantiated allegation in relation to his business activities and his ongoing attacks on my family and business associates I reserve the right to respond.

I suggest that you delete this post and the other one all together.

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Admin

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #52 on: July 23, 2007, 10:50:52 PM »

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Quote from: Kharkovite on July 23, 2007, 10:31:22 PM
Dan I understand but as I said I did not raise this issue on this forum, I am merely responding to his ongoing vendetta. Mr. Mowatt has and continues to make unsubstantiated false claims. He has on more them one occasion published on this site and others personal information. Information that has placed myself,. my family and my associates at some risk

His comment about American Bride hunters is another example of his personal issues.

Why he raised this issue on this site under this contact I fail to comprehend. As long as he continues to make such unsubstantiated allegation in relation to his business activities and his ongoing attacks on my family and business associates I reserve the right to respond.

I suggest that you delete this post and the other one all together.



As persistent as Mowatt is with hawking his interests - so too you seem to be intent on seeing YOUR agenda carried out here.

If you have nothing to contribute to the theme and Vision of RWD, then don't bother to bring your tripe here. If you feel there is ANYTHING posted here which causes you any fear, anxiety, or risk - feel free to use the Report to Moderator button and I assure you it will receive attention.

As for Mowatt - we are fully-equipped to handle that garbage here ourselves, without your interjections.

- Dan
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Kharkovite

Re: Now for a real war story
« Reply #53 on: July 24, 2007, 11:58:56 PM »

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Thanks BUT I did not start this issue and I am only responding in reply. Again I suggest that you remove the post along with the other Social Enterprise advertisement posted by Mr. Mowatt who continues to publish not only on this site but other sites false and misleading statements.


As you correctly pointed out many of your readers have independently identified and raised a number of issues many of which we had already identified. All the best.

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